| Author | Message | ||
     Tim@Netherlands |
In perfect state. Not a spec of rust or anything. Good deal? He wants 550 for it but I think 500 would be more fair, hopefully I can convince him to sell it to me for 500. It seems like a good deal to me, what do you guys think? | ||
| langley |
For $550.00 US you can buy a brand new Fender Hot Rod Deluxe that sounds like crap, right out of the box. Considering the marvelous tone and construction of the 210-65, I feel that these amps should sell, when in pristeen condition, for nothing less than $750.00 US. | ||
| Steve Kennedy |
I couldn't have said it better myself (although I think I try from time to time)! While the current market value may not be that high, it is only because the Music Man amps are relative "sleepers" in the collector's market so it is primarily actual amp USERS who buy them! This keeps the price lower than their intrinsic value. Also, because these amps are 20-30 years old, most of them bought used will probably require some sort of repair or maintenance. There can be the perception of an "old tube amp" that can actually hurt resale value in the eyes of the younger crowd (who weren't even born while Music Man was in business and don't know any better, thinking that a 25 watt solid-state Marshall or a Line 6 modeling amp is the pinnacle of amp technology). Of course, we KNOW better (being old as dirt and all). The quality of the components, design and construction of the Music Man amps are second to none. The ONLY amps that even approach parity in terms of quality of construction and components are the "boutique" amps that sell for many THOUSANDS of dollars, and many don't sound as good! If you look at them that way, Music Man amps OUGHT to sell for $1200-$1500 when fully restored! They don't now, but I think a lot more of people may wake up in the next decade! Steve | ||
| John D. |
Right on the mark, Steve. Things are only worth what people are willing to pay for them, and in this case, the true value of a MM amp can only be determined by someone who has played through one. I just traded straight across for a 65-210 myself, and I gave a 30-year-old Yamaha B212 and a Gallien-Krueger MLS112, both in mint condition with covers. I got the best of the deal. And the dealer had the MM with a price tag of $500, which you know was negotiable. The amp needed tubes and was DIRTY, but it cleaned up well and a new set of Svets gave its bark back. Under the dirt was a real beauty. It now looks nearly factory new. What's the worth of that? To me, a lot. To someone else, probably nothing. | ||
| langley |
"Things are only worth what people {buyers} are willing to pay." Bullshyt. "It takes 1 to tango" is only true for conjoined twins and schitzophrenics. It's the buyer's place to "Buy Low". It's the seller's place to "Sell High". And not the other way 'round. (Except, perhaps in cases of hardship.) In a business transaction, selling price = product + seller's savvy + buyer's savvy. In this equation there is one somewhat "fixed" number (product price) and two complete variables (the Seller/Buyer). See the wiggle room? Use it to your advantage (interpret the body language) - As buyer or seller! All that is needed to increase MM's desireability is to advertise a little. Spread the good word. And MM amps are so darn good that we don't have to 'spin' any of it! After all, nothing sounds as good or lasts as long as a Music Man amp. Nothing. Nada. Zero. If we don't tout the wonders of our product why would anyone desire it? (Let's load up on bargains - now!) My 210-65 (transitional) is from ~1978, and has never ever failed, or required more than simple biasing when I change EL-34's. Even the fuse is original. How many Marshall owners can say that? | ||
| Wayne Petrosko |
i just finished restoring a 65-210 reverb. i did a recone of the original speakers with original cones from a place here in pittsburgh that had them and found some NOS RCA EL34's and a 12AX7.(i would have liked the sylvania's but oh well) with a rebias, new EB cab corners and casters along with new original tolex , i think i like her better than my two stacks, my 212RH half stack and my 65-212 reverb. at least it's easier to carry around, but amps that sond this good command a high price for sale... they've earner it. | ||
| Steve Kennedy |
"Worth" or "Value" is different for everyone. Just because I think my 210-RD-100-EVM is worth $10,000 doesn't mean you agree and would be willing to pay that much for it. A "market" for the resale of an amp (like almost any Music Man model) is very fluid and constantly changing. Ultimately, the sale price is what you can actually get for it (when it actually sells, not to be confused with the asking price) and quite often has little to do with its worth or value to either the seller or the buyer. If the instrinsic value is high but the acquisition cost was low, then the buyer got a great deal! However, he may never be able to resell that amp for what he believes its "worth" unless he hooks up with a buyer that values the amp as much or more than the negotiated selling price range would indicate. | ||
| Langley |
$10,000 ? for your amp? I'll take 2! (oh, not really) Alot of us have gotten used to distribution side purchasing. Example: I go to a store and ask the salesman for a shirt that's displayed in the window. He retrieves it. I buy it. This is 'distribution'. Although a 'sale' has occurred 'selling' has not. Example: You go to a store and ask the salesman for the same shirt. He shmoozes you. He treats you like family. You walk out of the store with the shirt, a pair of sox, a hanky, shoes, and a $400 Italian suit. Now that's a sale! (sellers point of view, of course.) We're mostly a bunch of techies. We see the world in binary. But the world is not a binary place. | ||
| John D. |
I repeat. Something is only worth what someone else is willing to pay for it...that's what drives the capitalist system and establishes fair market value on anything. The word "fair" is a misnomer, admitedly. Steve said it well. I guess the word "worth" is probably a loaded one, in that (I concede)the selling price of something may NOT line up with its intrinsic value. But in the context of buying/selling, the final "worth" is set by the cash that changes hands. Enough said. We all agree on one thing: MM amps are a superior product and we are all fortunate to own one (or two, in my case). | ||
| Anonymous |
Things are only worth what someone is willing to pay for it? Try pricing a used toyota or honda. Capitalism you speak of sure ain't practiced in this country any more. | ||
| John D. |
I'm not sure I understand your comment about a used toy or honda...but I still stick by my statement. If something sits on a shelf long enough, the seller will keep lowering the price until, eventually, he will find a buyer at a lower price or get rid of the item in some other manner. There are only two things that motivate people: pain and profit. And the "worth" of something is directly plugged into the "profit" part of the human makeup. There are three reasons I can think of why you don't buy something: you don't need it, you don't want it, or you can't afford it. All of these are negotiable and price can motivate a change in the status of any of these three. Example: you don't need it or want it. But if you can buy it cheap enough, you might buy it to resell at a higher price. If that ain't capitalism, I guess i don't know what it is. Just a thought. | ||
| Douglas W. Fink (dfink) Username: dfink Registered: 06-2007 |
Remember too for value of anything 2 conditions must be met: 1. you want to sell it 2. somebody wants to buy it for x amount of dollars. So by this logic my 210-sixty-five is pretty much worth a big fat ZERO~ cuz I will never sell it. That being said, I think Steve above said it best..it takes a bit of time and playing to understand why Musicaman, old marshall plexi, and older fender tube amps rock out..TUBES rule. Younger players get googly eyed over solid state with lots and lots of dials, pedals, effects, etc...where as most of us on this board..well cranking up the 210 to get a bit-o-tube distortion and a guitar and patch cable is really all one needs...Yes? |